Interviews
The book is organized by using each of Castro’s ten days in NYC as a short chapter chronicling the movements of Khrushchev, Eisenhower, Castro and other leaders who participated in the 1960 UN General Assembly meeting. Do you have a favorite day's activities that were the most interesting to you as a historian?
Well, Monday September 19th is pretty great: it begins with Khrushchev arriving in New York, and ends with Fidel holed up in the Theresa, chatting with Malcolm X, having earlier stormed out of his Midtown hotel in a huff. But my favorite is Thursday September 22nd: President Eisenhower speaks at the UN, then holds a lunch for Latin American leaders, but snubs Fidel by not inviting him. Fidel responds by treating the employees of the Theresa to steak and beers, declaring that he in any case much preferred to eat with the “poor and humble people of Harlem.” Then, that evening, Fidel takes star billing at a reception held in the Theresa’s ballroom, with Amiri Baraka, Allen Ginsberg, C. Wright Mills, and Henri Cartier-Bresson among the guests.
Did you uncover any unknown information?
Not so much in terms of uncovering a killer fact or document. I think that what is really original about this book, though, is that it covers the trip as a whole – placing it within the context of the Cold War, decolonization, Cuba’s relationship with both the United States and the Soviet Union, the emerging (global) New Left and counterculture, and the powerful connections with the African American freedom struggle.
I did get quite excited, though, when I discovered a telegram from NAACP national headquarters, which was sent to all local leaders in New York, instructing them to decline any invitation to meet with Fidel. That gave a real insight into the national leadership’s worries about any kind of association with communism, and their determination to maintain a tight control over local branches.
How has time changed the way people view the early days of the Castro regime in Cuba?
There’s no doubt that the later history of the revolution – particularly the poor record on human rights, freedom of speech, homophobia, and the relatively poor state of the economy, have had an impact. But I’m actually struck by how many people still seem to view those early years in a somewhat romantic way. When you look at the newsreels and photographs of those days, you can sort of understand why – those Cuban revolutionaries are so young, so fearless, so photogenic, so refreshing! And, of course, the Cuban government have, with some justification, been able to blame the American economic blockade for at least some of the island’s economic problems.
How did you choose which photos to use?
It was difficult – there are so many wonderful images of the trip. I definitely wanted some of the Theresa itself, and the crowds that gathered in the streets every day to cheer Fidel and show their support. I also wanted photos to illustrate some of Fidel’s key meetings – with Malcolm, Khrushchev, Nasser, and so on. And I tried to select images that captured the drama – and the quirkiness – of the trip. There was one photo that I really wanted to use, but we couldn’t find the original – it’s of Love B. Woods, the owner of the Theresa, standing next to his head chef, inspecting a roast chicken that’s been prepared for Fidel!
In some ways we are still having the same international disagreements about imperialism, socialism, and the rights of so-called “underdeveloped” countries on the world stage — has much changed since the 15th UN General Assembly?
My sense is that, in 1960, there was a lot of genuine hope that real and positive change was on the way. The admission of so many newly-independent countries from Africa to the UN – 1960 was the so-called “Year of Africa” – was seen as a really big deal; and the UN really seemed to matter, too. But the crisis in the Congo that was intensifying on the eve of the Assembly (Patrice Lumumba was deposed in a coup on 14 September) showed very clearly that these hopes might not be fully realized. I think that one of the most prescient things that Fidel said during his landmark, 4 ½ hour speech at the UN, was that “it is very easy to raise a flag, choose a coat of arms, sing and anthem and put another color on the map,” but “there can be no political independence unless there is economic independence.”
You talk about the role of many important political figures of the 60s, and not just those who participated in the 10 days of the UN General Assembly. The UN meeting featured politicians such as Castro, Khrushchev, Eisenhower, Nehru, Egyptian & UAR leader Gamal Abdel Nasser, Ghanaian leader Kwame Nkrumah, but you also explain how Patrice Lumumba, Che Guevara, Chairman Mao, Kim Il Sung, and artistic luminaries such as Allen Ginsberg, Maya Angelou, Malcom X, photographer Henri-Cartier Bresson, and intellectuals and activists such as Amiri Baraka, Jean Paul Sartre, Simone de Beauvoir, Stokely Carmichael, and Angela Davis factor into the social and political discussion of the time. What was it like to revisit this time of political, intellectual and artistic mingling, and do you think the same atmosphere exists today?
One of the things that really appealed to me about this story was the extraordinary array of people who were a part of it: political heavyweights like Eisenhower and Khrushchev; icons of the anticolonial struggle like Nehru and Nkrumah; and then this whole panoply of African American freedom fighters, poets, writers and artists. So the opportunity to revisit that world of big political disagreements (and personalities), glamour and the emerging counterculture was incredibly seductive and captivating. In an age of Donald Trump, Boris Johnson and YouTube influencers, it’s hard not to feel that we are a bit short-changed! But then it also depends where you look – there are plenty of inspirational figures, including from the world of politics, academia, the arts and elsewhere, who are involved in contemporary global movements for gender equality, racial justice, and environmentalism, for instance.
Was there anything that surprised you when writing?
This was just one of those stories when, just when I thought things couldn’t get any wilder, or any more irreverent, or anarchic – they did!
