Poured Over: Ryka Aoki on Light From Uncommon Stars

“But when I write, that’s when I feel I can take part in society, I can contribute to ideas, and to teach and to share, and to say, I love you to society—to maybe talk about some of the difficult things in life, but to affirm that these experiences only serve to make life what it is.” From space aliens and cursed violins to a Queen of Hell with a heart, to found family, coming-of-age and living in your truest self, Ryka Aoki’s Light from Uncommon Stars is our latest Speculative Fiction Monthly Pick and it’s an absolute blast to read. Ryka joins us on the show to talk about world-building, the San Gabriel Valley, writing love stories, the evolution of science fiction, her literary inspirations, donuts and more with Poured Over’s host, Miwa Messer. And we end this episode with TBR Topoff book recommendations from Marc and Becky.

Featured Book (episode)

Light from Uncommon Stars by Ryka Aoki

Featured Books (TBR Topoff)

Blackwater Sister by Zen Cho

The House in the Cerulean Sea by TJ Klune

Poured Over is produced and hosted by Miwa Messer and mixed by Harry Liang. New episodes land Tuesdays and Thursdays (with occasional Saturdays) here and on your favorite podcast app.

Full transcript for this episode:

B&N: I’m Miwa Messer, I’m the producer and host of Poured Over and Ryka Aoki. And I think I just messed up your last name.

Ryka Aoki: That’s okay. Okay, it’s actually Ryka Aoki. Although people do say I-O-Key, you know, whatever. Yeah, as long as the name on the book is me, we’re good.

B&N: Well, there’s that. Light from Uncommon Stars is our August Speculative Fiction Monthly Pick. And we are so excited for a new readership to come to you, and Katrina, and the Queen of Hell with a heart, which we’re going to get to in a minute, and lon trans. So thank you, Ryka, for joining us on the show. This is so exciting. I’m so happy to see you. But I want to start with something that I read about you in an interview, you were quoting one of your former MFA professors at Cornell. Writing is a public act? Can we talk about that for a second, because this is a major, major point for you as a creative.

RA: Sure. And as a public act, I want to thank Barnes and Noble for having me on this wonderful podcast and for the readers who have come to my book, writing, I’ve always thought of writing as a public act. On a personal level, I’m a bit of an introvert. And I tend to be the one at the parties when she is not talking about her books, or anything, just kind of standing by the club soda, and trying not to get horribly drunk and trying to do something with my hands that doesn’t look totally awkward. But when I write, that’s when I feel I can take part in society, I can contribute to ideas, and to teach and to share, and to say, I love you to society to maybe talk about some of the difficult things in life, but to affirm that these experiences only serve to make life what it is, and some things should be shared, something that’s best to be shared. So with my writing, I feel kind of paradoxically, that it’s a public that it’s a public act for me, because I’m usually such a private person. But I do feel my work is something that is there for anybody to read, if you you know, in this book, without going into spoilers, there’s space in there, and there’s music and there’s violins and there’s Asian things. And you know, you can talk about queer things because I happen to be queer, but most of it is all about facing a world that we’re part of that we might not be able to change. And we might not be able to win all the time. And we might not be able to get things exactly the way we wish it would be. But that doesn’t stop us from loving who we are as we are. And so that’s kind of this book and what I like to do with my writing to share my own particular story, and maybe join it with yours.

B&N: So let’s set up Light from Uncommon Stars for the readers who may not have experienced it yet. I mean, it was out in hardcover, it’s now in paperback. But this is part of the beauty of a paperback release, because

RA: I know, people will come in and there’s a beautiful new cover. Yes.

B&N: So, let’s introduce readers to the three women who are really the soul of this book.

RA: I have three women that I feel whose lives would not ordinarily have met. But when I throw them together, they find companionship, they find very unexpected family and they find very unexpected love even though they may not even feel they deserve it. So, the first character, her name is Shizuka Satomi. And she is an older woman, and she has been a violin player and a violin teacher. And something happened to her where she lost her music, at least in her own mind and she made a deal with the devil and she regrets it immediately and wants to get her soul back and because usually, we do have buyer’s remorse about things like cars and handbags. Imagine the buyer’s remorse you get from selling your soul. And so she makes a rather amoral deal to get her soul back by selling out seven others. We shall be avenged sevenfold. She’s got six she took care of six and she’s got one more and who is this going to be? She’s just not a human trying to get her soul back. She happens to be an artist and she wants to make this last soul sort of her magnum opus she wants to say something with this. And so she doesn’t just want to do the assignment, she wants extra credit. And she ends up running into the second character here, whose name is Katrina Nguyen. And she’s from the East Bay. She’s from one of the sort of more industrial suburbs of, of Oakland, probably grew up, eating a lot of good seafood, probably mariscos, and she runs away from home because she is, she’s trans. And just from my experience, and from a lot of the other experiences that that I know from other trans people. It’s not a great existence. And so she runs away from home to save herself. She has this dream of playing Annie Mae and Gaming Music on her violin and starting a YouTube channel and making money that way, which is not an option I had when I was growing up. And I wish I had that. And so she escapes to Los Angeles on a big ol Asian bus. The third person in this is Well, eventually she gets hungry and needs donuts. Actually, yes, actually, without spoiling too much he has to pee. And so she meets Lan Tran, who is a Vietnamese space alien, who runs a donut shop and has escaped with her family because there’s a galactic war, the basically refugees, and they, they lied and sort of cheated, not cheated, but they kind of lied their way to escape persecution. They did what they could, and they scrambled, She’s protecting her family. And really, that’s her main thing. She just wants to live a good life with doughnuts and protect her family because there’s war going out there. And she just wants safety. And she wants the suburbs and she wants people to come to her donut shop. And so the three of them eventually meet and they meet each other and they share and Lan has a family has, you know, some children, I’m not going to talk about too much, but they’re involved too. These chance encounters are what propels the story for what what makes each of the story each of the characters question not only their goals, but also the limitations because each of them has sort of limited their dreams of what they want to do. And seeing themselves reflected in each other gives them ideas that maybe they can expect more, they can be more.

B&N: It is so much fun watching these women figure out their paths, and watching them come together. As a family. It’s really, it’s so exciting and hopeful and fun and smart. And even when you get frustrated with them. They’re very human, even the aliens. But you also bring them together in a place in the world. The San Gabriel Valley. For those of us who know that this part of the valley, it is super Asian American, but it’s a mix of Asian American. I mean, Monterey Park is there and it is a hugely Chinese American community. Everyone’s in the San Gabriel Valley. So let’s talk about that for a second. Because you grew up there, right?

RA: Yes, I did. I went to San Gabriel High School, the San Gabriel Valley used to be used to belong to indigenous people. It became a Mexican Spanish colony. It so it had empire. Later, there were German settlers that lived there. And then again, always with a strong Latino population. And then later, the Asians came first. First, you know, a lot of Japanese came. And Chinese came to work, both agriculture and railroad. And then after that, now, this is all happening on the same land. You know, and then, you know, after that we had some Asians who were refugees from the Vietnam War came over. So we had people from Laos and Cambodia and Vietnam. We had Thai people coming over to during that time, because that war displaced a lot of people who, they didn’t really respect national boundaries, people just came. And then after that, the Chinese American community had a bit of a change as the older Chinese who came to work railroad, mostly Tucson, you know, suddenly there was this influx of people from Hong Kong who started to come in because of British you know, giving Hong Kong back to the the back to China, a lot of people who lived in Hong Kong left and they came San Gabriel Valley. And then beyond that a lot of when the Japanese opened up, more Japanese came in. And then now, there’s a huge amount of investment from a PRC, from People’s Republic of China that’s all coming in. And so what you end up getting here is you end up getting a lot of layers. So it’s not simply this is Black, or this is white. You have layering. And what makes San Gabriel Valley so interesting is it’s not divided in the same way that you know, the white people live on the hill and the people of color live down by you know, the other side of the tracks, everyone’s kind of mixed in. And so you’ll have a business that was once owned by, you know, Latinos, that was that that ended up being owned by a Japanese person that got bought out by a Chinese person, and then they left and suddenly it’s being it’s being run by lotions. And I just find that really, something very special, and very magical about the San Gabriel Valley. And I wanted to write about it because it’s my hometown, and I didn’t want somebody to come in from the outside and write about it without having love for the space. I think everyone can understand that, right? We all have our hometown, and we all have a certain affection for it, and we want to be the people writing about it. You know, I tell my my writing students, write about your hometown, if you have, if you write about your hometown, if you want to write about your hometown, you write about your hometown before somebody else does it wrong?

B&N: Well, and that’s the thing, too, I think there are a lot of folks who don’t live in LA or LA County, who think of Southern California solely as Hollywood and Disneyland. Like that. That’s kind of it. And it’s like, well, there’s a little more happening here. I mean, I live not that far from Filipino town when I’m in LA. So you know.

RA: The nice thing about a city like LA is just about when you think you know it, the businesses have all changed, and everything’s new again, I tell people that Los Angeles is a great place to live in, but I wouldn’t want to visit. I think that people say, you know, I have a week in LA, how can I take in the city, and I just say, I don’t know, stay in one neighborhood and enjoy yourself or just turn your mind off and just go from place to place. You’re not going to get Los Angeles in a week, you’re not going to get Los Angeles in five years. Los Angeles, unlike New York, or San Francisco or Chicago, it’s more diffuse. You know, Chinatown is not where you should go for Chinese food. Little Tokyo is not where you should go for sushi. You know, although I do go to Little Tokyo for sushi from time to time. But if you want really cool Japanese food, you’re in Torrance, if you really want cool Chinese food, you’re going into the San Gabriel Valley, there’s enough of Los Angeles to make people think they know it. But there’s a deeper Los Angeles that takes so long to learn. And I think one of the advantages of being in Los Angeles is it’s kind of because I know that trope, it helps me write characters better, and stories better. Because somebody is from Los Angeles, or you know, just any character, I realized there’s this layer that we think is there that can be easily defined. And this deeper, more expansive reality that if you really take the time to get to know, it opens up to you. And so I want my stories to be like Los Angeles, where, you look at them, and you can read them on the surface level, and you can have Disneyland, and you can have the beach and you can have these things and and I hope you know I hope I write pretty enough that that happens. But it’s also one where you know, if you pick up the book later, and you go in and you read it more deeply, I hope to reward you with a deeper story and deeper characterizations, that will be very grateful that you took the time out to to get to know them.

B&N: Part of that too is the way you write about women and ambition. Shizuka and Lan and Katrina all have dreams and goals and things they want to do. But we don’t often talk about women’s ambition in a way that isn’t sort of de sultry or just kind of like well, we don’t always have a grip on ambition and I’m dancing around a little bit because obviously I’m trying to avoid spoilers and you know what I’m trying to avoid talking about, but it’s wild the way their worlds just kind of expand.

RA: I don’t want to generalize too much, because all women are different. But with that being said, I think that most of the women that I know and I talk about and I admire, that’s the best one. Most of the women that I admire, there’s a realism to them, they’re not going to buy the, I’m going to go to the moon. And I’m going to do this and climb Everest and put my flag up there kind of more like, sure, I might be climbing Everest, but how many resources am I using up? Who am I hurting? What am I doing? I think that ambition becomes a much more nuanced thing to have with, with these women that I admire. Because they realize that personal ambition is always balanced by the damage one might do in the world, or the repercussions, or just the feeling to understand that Sure, I’m climbing Everest, but when I get down from Everest, I have to still wash dishes. You know, the reality that there’s no end where I think that a lot of hero fiction that’s driven by male writers see ambition, you reach this ambition, and you win and the story ends, story doesn’t end. Tomorrow, you wake up and you might get into a fight with your child and your child is you know, growing a mustache and it’s too early and you’re mad, you know, just life happens. And so, what I wanted to do with this book without spoiling it, is I was thinking to myself, I can write about space and and violins and aliens and throw donuts in there and, and do all of these things. Can I find a way for women in this story, the women in this story to be like the women I admire to have goals, and reach them in their own way. While they fully bear the knowledge that women have that it’s never over.

B&N: I’m gonna steal a an image from you. You’re talking actually about a violin, and a violin that’s being repaired and said, What makes a violin special is not its fragility, but its resilience. And these women are really resilient. It takes a little bit of time for them to figure it out. But wow, they are resilient. And it’s really wonderful to see as they sort of figure out what’s happening. The thing is, there’s music in your background, too. You’ve written music, you’re a composer, there’s a rock opera.

RA: Yeah, I have a rock opera. And one of these days somebody is going to stage it, but you know, that’s what I’m hoping. But we’ll conquer one world at a time. And we’ll get to that later, when you know, it comes to resilience. I think that and music. Why think with music, music, you go from something familiar, you jump into a bridge, literally called a bridge, and you bring it back and you play with the man. And you test the theme, right? You alter its tempo, you change instrumentations, you pull back, you do so much, and it’s still the melody. Now the interesting thing is, at least I think it’s interesting is that when it comes to the violin, the violin to me was really something that and the resilience of identity that you can. So, without spoiling too much in the book, there’s another character who is a who runs a violin shop. And so what is being marveled about with the violin is you can modify the violin quite a bit. And it’s still the violin, in fact, a Stradivarius if you hear a Strad being played right now, you are hearing an instrument that has been heavily modified, originally Strads were set up like early music instruments with you know, God strings, and low tension. And nowadays, the the modern violins are set with you know, steel or Gutwein strings or, and with cores and the fingerboard is pulled back just a little bit, and it’s completely the geometries completely shifted, but it’s still a Stradivarius. And it made me think about the so much. And this is me being very selfish. It made me think about what it meant to be trans woman and how we modify our bodies. There are sound posts to think about. They’re all these other things and, but identity doesn’t come from any of that. Right? Your identity comes from the music you make, knowing that that’s not going to solve transphobia you know, let’s be real, but internally, if I’m making music, that I feel as genuine and authentic to me, then not accepting who I am is not my problem. And yeah, I’ll just keep doing the best I can. So the resilience is, and that’s kind of my call to transform. And that’s like, yeah, people may doubt, you buy or form. But you’re resilient.

B&N: There are so many moments of pure joy in this story. And there are moments that involve food. I mean, do not read this book while you are hungry. Please just do yourself a favor and have snacks at hand. And it can be donuts. We’ll talk about donuts more later. But really, the way you talk about food is so much a part of any piece of Asian American culture, like food is a thing. And there’s so much joy around food, there’s so much joy around music. I mean, Katrina has some moments when she’s playing that are clearly transcendent for her, and it is so much fun to be a part of that as the reader, but we gotta talk about joy for a second. Did anything surprise you while you were writing Light from Uncommon Stars, because I feel like you knew where we were going. And we’re going to come to influences in a second. You knew where we were going, you knew who these women were. But did anything surprise you?

RA: I think what really surprised me at the end was how the family especially without spoiling, especially the donut shop family, even though they are space, aliens, how they come at the end, and where I leave them at the end was just joyful. I think it ended in a very beautiful, but I think there’s still an Asian family, right, they still kind of did Asian family things. And, I thought that was something that I didn’t think would matter so much to me, when I wrote the book, but that’s the part that made me kind of tear up. You know, it’s like, oh, they get to have this. Oh, okay. We’re happy. And the other part of joy that I really wanted to do here is I wanted to a lot of times when you’re a woman and you write books, people automatically assume that going into YA, they’re going to young adults, and there’s a lot of great literature that goes into young adult and YA so I’ve never taken that as anything, but you know, thank you. But this book isn’t particularly some of the subject matters not YA. A lot of it is you know, and if a young adult reads it, great, I have no objections to that. But what I wanted to do, and the reason I think some people are confused is it’s got some YA tropes. But I wanted to write a why a novel for older lovers. And that’s why there is a romance in here. And it’s, it’s between two of the older characters. And it’s a goofy romance, and they they get derpy for each other, and they get awkward, and they have silly misunderstandings, and they feel guilty about it, and they have awkward reconciliations, and they fight over noodles. And, but these are the older characters. And I thought to myself, I wanted to give older readers the joy of fluttering about and crashing on somebody, and things like that, because goodness knows, in this pandemic, we all need something to flatter about.

B&N: And one of the things I appreciate too, is just the representation in general, you cover a lot of ground with your characters in this book, and you’ve talked about this in other interviews in your past, where you’ve said, you know, these are exactly the kinds of people I needed to see, when I was growing up and your parents that sort of discourage you from from being a writer, because there’s no money in it. But at the same time, immigrant parents just want their kids to succeed in everything else. I did not become a consultant, I became a bookseller. We have our pads. But I do want to talk about the golden age of science fiction and the influence of that sort of had for you as a writer, because you always identified as a poet first. And you have an MFA. But you had a moment before you wrote Light from Uncommon Stars where suddenly science fiction became a part of your literary diet. Let’s call it that. So can we talk about that for a second? How did that really come about? And how did that give you the freedom to stretch a little bit? I mean, your poet imagery, you can do a lot with words.

RA: Yeah, and I still like to think that I do tell my my editor, I still write at the speed of poet, you know. And so, and I have another couple of weeks, I grew up, really gravitating towards science fiction. So yeah, I was trained as a poet, and that’s what my MFA is. And, but what I was reading when I was growing up was very, it was all over the place. And I really enjoyed science fiction, because there was escape, you know, don’t want to get into this too much. But you know, you look at some of my essays. And, you know, my childhood wasn’t always the happiest thing. And when you grew up kind of queer, and you don’t really have the vocabulary for it, this world seems inadequate to describe who you are. And science fiction, it might not have been the world that I wanted, but at least it’ll let me know there were other worlds. And so reading the people who are published at the time, reading people like Isaac Asimov, reading people, you know, and then reading people like Doc Smith, reading all of the Star Trek novelizations, all of James Bush’s work and Dean Foster’s work, with the animated series, these were all things that I grew up with. And also with these different books, there were, there were more diverse casts. And there were, you did have your George Takeis of the world. And you know, if you’re watching, Hi, George, I love you, okay. And you know, and all of these things going on, but there were still and up till very recently there will talk more, but the science fiction world has changed quite a bit. I really love that. But when I was writing, I decided, well, what if I bring the people that I grew up with, into my universe, and give them the stars and really good donuts and, I know they play great music, because I’ve heard it. And I know they make great donuts. But maybe we can give them the stars, maybe I can give them my idea of what they might be dreaming about. And you know, even if I’m not completely right, maybe that’ll catalyze them to dream. What? And not just that, if I do all of these things, how does it change what I give the readers? How does it change the experience? Who does it let in? Who more can how many people will be able to read this book now and say, hey, I want that. Because, you know, in the in the end, it’s like, as as beautiful as Star Trek was, if you were trans, you would still probably not be that accepted. And I didn’t want to fight for universe like that, I wanted to have one where it didn’t matter. Or maybe it could be seen as a good thing. Go figure. So with this book, I said, Hey, you know, I signed a contract with Tor. And I noticed they signed it to, we’re gonna push this. And Tor by the way has been spectacular. And, I’m just so thankful to them. And what came out was a story that I think people will enjoy. And I’ve gotten a lot of really good. Great fan mail, great feedback from readers, saying that, yeah, I probably did, okay. And I’ll continue to do OKRs. I’ll try.

B&N: Light from Uncommon Stars is so full of love. And it’s so full of unexpected moments. And it’s so full of witty banter, you do a lot of witty banter in this tank, which is fun, very fun. But let’s talk about some of your literary inspirations that don’t come out of sci fi, because you’re clearly pulling from a lot of different places. So who are some of the other writers you love to read?

RA: Well, for better or worse, you know, if you read Light from Uncommon Stars, it can seem a little bit shocking at first because I’m switching POVs quite a bit. So this book, I switch points of view quite often. I do this for a lot of reasons because I think living as especially living as somebody who’s queer or as person of color, we’re switching identities and voices in our head as we go. You know, I was just talking with you seeing, you know, somebody who is Asian and is Japanese, you know, suddenly, I want to speak Japanese. I’m trying to filter so I don’t speak and so we’re always switching voices. And so somebody like say I’m Virginia Woolf and The Waves. This was a book that was really let me know that I could do this, how she just switched points of view. So, Virginia Woolf is an incredibly important, incredibly important writer to me. And then the other novelist who really made it feel like it would be possible for a poet to write, to write novels, was Toni Morrison. Because Toni Morrison, if you read Beloved, and you open any page in that book, you’ll get a poem. The way she uses language is so rich, and so varied and gorgeous, even when she’s talking about horrible, horrible things. That language is just so central, so beautiful. And I like to have stars in the sky. And I was thinking to myself, well, I don’t think I’m going to get to Tony Morrison anytime soon, which ironically, frees me up to try to reach Tony Morrison, when I’m writing this book. I’m thinking of Virginia Woolf. I’m thinking of Toni Morrison, I’m thinking in terms of poetry. I’m thinking of poets, you know, everything from, you know, Mary Baraka and Etheridge Knight all the way out to somebody like Jane Canyon, you know, where you just the beauty in the language. There’s like the Hawaiian poets like Julia Cornel, and things like that, that write about home so beautifully. And I want to sort of bring some of that in. Garrett huncle writer wrote a poem about the essence of garlic. That really made me think about using food. So I pull from a lot of different things. There’s also a Sansei poet. I may not get her name, right. But her I think it’s Amy Uyematsu, who writes just this beautiful, these beautiful just musings on being in Los Angeles and, you know, she’s one generation above me, she’s a Sansei. And so all of this together are all mentors. And people I could not have written this book without. And then of course, my Cornell crew did my MFA at Cornell. So, Archie Emmons, AR Ammons poet, told me a couple beautiful things, he told me once he said, if you, through your work, can improve the human condition, even a little bit, you’ll be rewarded beyond your wildest dreams. And I thought to myself back then, I’m gonna go for that one. I mean, it’s not like not improving the human condition was ever an option for me, because I’m not hurt. And so I’ve been trying with my work, through my art, not compromising my art, but through my work to make people’s lives a little more worthwhile. And yeah, it’s just always been my goal, Ken McLean, who really helped me deal with racism in publishing. And, you know, he would tell me things that had happened. He and Amiri Baraka are friends, you know, and we’re talking about what it meant to, to face racism, and take advantage of the opportunities that this society had to offer, while emerging with most of your soul intact. And so I’ve had really strong mentors, Robert Morgan, who’s another one of my mentors, he really made me feel okay for going to the dark side and writing novels. And the funny thing is, Bob is up. Look up Robert Morgan, amazing stuff. I mean, he was like an Oprah pick. And I mean, it’s like, you know, I remember asking him, how does it feel to be one of Oprah’s picks and being famous, and he just looked at me, he goes, taxes, the taxes, but anyway, you know, when I told him that I was, I came out to him as transgender. He just looked at me and says, Well, you’ve always liked to travel. And we just continued as normal. But he taught me not to be afraid. And just said you’re still you. You’re still you. You can still you can see you’re still writing and you’re still teaching me he said that. And it’s like, I almost cried. No, I did cry. I did cry.

B&N: And well, you can really write that much we know so what’s next?

RA: I’m writing a sequel, not a sequel, but a spin off of my next of Light from Uncommon Stars. I’ve touched on with him melee, a halo, which is my first novel and this novel here. And Light from Uncommon Stars, I touched on Gods and demons, and things like that. And so this next novel was kind of going to be a little bit more about the cosmology, like what is going on behind the scenes. Tor was so generous to give me a free rein to write my next book. And I thought, Well, I’m not going to waste this. My first book was for my ancestors, my second book was for my friends. And the third book will be for my dreams, this is the this is the universe that I wish for all of us, it’s also going to be set somewhat in LA. But I’m also going to bring a little bit more of Japan in there, because there are going to be sort of displacements, I don’t want to spoil Light from Uncommon Stars, I certainly don’t want to uncover the next one. And then also, you know, if you look me up on Facebook, I write out on just Twitter, I have Ricoworld@bulletin.com, my newsletter if you want to catch up, because there’s a lot of times where there are things I’m researching that I that I’m researching that I’m not going to end up putting in the book, but it’s interesting. And it’s my way of chatting with people and saying, Thank you. And I’m also going to be, by the time this comes out, Comic Cons already gonna have come and gone. But I am a finalist for the Hugo Award. So if you’re reading this, please vote, please vote. I would love to win. But I guess in a nutshell though, what I’m going to be doing next is what I always do writing my best work, bringing it to readers saying with as best I can, I hope this makes your life a little more interesting, a little more worthwhile. And I’m incredibly grateful.

B&N: Before you go. Can I ask you one more question? But I have to ask, do you have a favorite donut?

RA: Okay, so my absolute favorite donut in the world that I can’t get, because that’s what makes it your favorite right? Is Amala sada which is a Hawaiian fried donut in Kohala. From Texas drive in Texas drive ins Malasadas. Now I know some people in Hawaii like Leonard’s but they’re on Honolulu and we all know Honolulu people are but the real good ones are actually on the Big Island and the ones I like are filled with barbarian crane and oh my gosh, you eat that and you sit there on the cliffs of Kohala. And you have the wind going through your head and you’re smelling the ocean and you’re drinking your fruit punch. It doesn’t get any better than that. And so that’s my absolute favorite doughnut in the world. Locally in Los Angeles, though, the Texas donut from Kendalls is amazing. So look for the Big Donut that’s not Randy’s you’re probably at Kendalls. Get the Texas donut and say hi to the Asian lady for me because she’s cool. And, and that’s it, you know and then but for you just questioning, you know, it’s like you come from the land of Dunkin Donuts. What do you think of the LA donut scene?

B&N: It’s deeply impressive. It is.I just I happen to be a fan of the you know, coconut flake cake donut from Dunkin.

RA: So they’re not quite donuts in the same way. But I thought you know, that’s like doughnuts at 100% Asian.

B&N: Well, and I love rice flour, new. I mean, big treats with rice flour are really fun. It’s just when I think of donuts I really do think of like very old school

RA: When I was in Boston, and I had my Dunkin donut, you know, with my with my hot cup of coffee and my Dunkin donut. Oh, no, no, no, I there’s, I get it. I completely get it. That’s about as classic as they come.

B&N: Well, I’m really looking forward to having a doughnut with you someday, we’ll figure out how to make it.

RA: Let’s figure out how to make it and then just really want to thank you. I really I know. This is you know, for the Barnes and Noble podcast, but I just want to thank everybody and I’ll make sure if I’m ever in town to stop and that Barnes and Noble and say hello.

B&N: Yes, please. Do. We’ve got stores in lots of different places. Ryka Aoki, please tell me I got it finally right. You know, my Boston comes flying out and my Japanese get scrambled when my Boston come flying out. So I’m gonna apologize that but my sister this was so really fun to have you on the show. Thank you so much for making the time.

RA: I really enjoyed this too. Thank you for doing this. And thank you just for everything this podcast is doing to like help writers, talk to readers and to meet people. It can be a bit of a lonely job kind of out here typing and to be able to get out here talk about my work and to say thank you means everything to me. So thank you.

B&N: Well, you’re stuck with us. So we’re just waiting for the next book.

RA: All the best and you know, everybody stay hell Have a and if you’re sick I hope you get better soon.

B&N: Thank you. Thank you.